It’s really remarkable how much expectations or anticipations for, say, a song or an album can completely change and often ruin your evaluation and subsequent enjoyment of it. With the new Younger Brother, Ott and Shpongle players on the horizon (however far off) I think this topic bears some discussion. Perhaps those that glean something from it will enjoy their albums more!
This epiphany really hit me hard with the release of the latest Amon Tobin player, ‘The Foley Room.’ Before this album came out, I had 2 sources of expectations: his prior albums and a live set he recorded in France in 2006. Both of these sources had me expecting the musical equivalent of a fine porterhouse steak: thick, meaty and substantial.
I downloaded the advance copy (a transcode, unfortunately, but good enough to whet my thirst) and on my first few listens, left feeling rather hungry, to continue the food analogy. Where I was hoping for an infernal bassline, I’d get a mangled pitch-bent sample of an insect masturbating. Where I wanted crazy rhythms and walls of sound, I’d get treated acoustic swells.
It took over 5 listens before I realized that the problem was with me. The Foley Room is like a fine French dish ... subtle, rich with detail, and interesting. The kind of dish that people pay $100 for. However, no matter how good that French dish is, I was not going to like it if I went into the restaurant thinking it was a steakhouse!
As soon as I started listening to it hungering for a more minimal/subtle dish, the album’s strengths just burst out at me, begging to be observed. It was like a whole new album! And I’ve since elevated it to the status of Amon’s last 3 albums, which were all various ‘Permutations’ of brilliant (get it?).
So I certainly let this be a lesson to me, and I will try my hardest to incorporate it into all of my listening. This is especially pertinent because of all the fearful speculation about Shpongle’s 4th disc. My current view: Let’s see what ya got, Si & Raj. Nothing further.
Any similar experiences? Responses? Disagreements? The interaction of good music and the human brain is a truly fascinating one!
Good point you make about objectivity. Often it’s exactly what’s lacking in the reviews of those who compare new releases to previous ones. No wonder these artists feel compelled to assume different names for different projects.
Foley Room’s a great example. It took a few turns for me to digest as well, but eventually came to appreciate its intricacies…That seems to be the case for most of Amon’s stuff, for me anyway…
First of all I really appreciate that Si P etc., use different names for different projects, since it is a bit different to other styles from himself… so, one can say, I want to listen to some psytrance… then go buy Hallucinogen… I want some cozy ambient… get Shpongle, I want some psybient, voice twisting and what not sound, get YB, so I think everyone somehow changing style (Infected Mushroom comes to mind with VD) I’d prefer if they had changed name for other style music, then one says I want psytrance, get IM, but I don’t want the other style stuff they did.
I believe that many don’t even dare to change names, so they can get people with their artist names, so older success sort of helps them with the success of the new style… (In other words, they keep (some of) the same fans who listened to their older stuff, rather than getting new fans), if you know what I mean.
Second, I think that sometimes not expecting something from a PC Game/Album/Artist can really help one to like the music, rather than imagining how it should sound and be disappointed… I do, once in a while, take away my expectations when wanting to buy something, or make my expectations purposely less then they otherwise would be.
...talking about PC Games too, I think (like me by Doom 3), not looking at trailers, videos, purposely covering images, in Game Magazines, of that game can also tremendiously help one to like the game.
Excellent subject to start and a very, very good point and one which has happened so many times with me. I did the same with Amon T and expected it to be tough beats etc like the last one. The first listen I said to myself ‘when is this gonna get started’.
After 3 or so listens the penny dropped and now I love it. Even without the heavy stuff it is still well hard due to the intense listening experience it offers and the sounds manipulated.
I often find if I’m tired and listen to a new cd I tend to be more harsher on my rating of it and other times cd’s takes 4-5 listens before you get the idea of what its about. A good example is the Kox Box album which I still listen to now.
In theory ‘neutral listening’ should always be employed but, personally, I find it incredibly difficult approaching music, especially music from familiar artists, with a completely objective mind and can’t help feeling that without comparison everything loses it’s value. I mean, let’s pretend, say, The Spice Girls, Britney Speares and N-Sync were the only artists to have ever made music, everybody would think at least one of those artists was brilliant when, in truth, they’re all terrible.
I beleive listening neutrality comes along with experience and self understanding.
Someone cannot appreciate a piece of art if they haven’t experienced situations that can bring out emotions that are deeply held in the subconscious.
That doesn’t mean that you have to fly a saucer to be able to get familiar emotions by listening to a space ambient track for example.But if you ‘ve ever read Jules Verne for example you are definately able to create millions of images in your mind by listening to a track like this.
Also think of the “The flight of the Bumblebee”. If it doesn’t make you imagine the thing that it’s written for - the flight of a bee - then you probably haven’t ever seen or listened a bee fly!
It’s hard to be objective but it’s not so hard to be patient if you love something (music in our case).
If you are bored to use your mind you can only love objects and bodys… not ideas and souls…
Interesting subject, dont you find that making music means you deconstruct other peoples music down to how it was made, i have to relax and just listen like when i was a child and it was just sound with no understanding otherwise its analytical, this also applys to your own music you absolutely must listen with nothing other than do i like it, is it flowing , is it moving me?. perception is a phenomena, some of the best music ever I never liked much first listen but it grew and survived , other stuff thats instantley good often wains with time….......sometimes….......Iam not sure…............lol u know what I mean
Malk
I certainly agree with your point that familiarity with the composition and production process does take some of the magic out of listening to other people’s productions. And the more you know, the higher your standards will rise.
I’ve solved this problem by listening to very different music from what I normally make. Since I normally make rhythmic, sequenced music, I tend to listen to a lot of ambient and soundscape-type music, which still sounds magical to me as I have no idea how some of those people create their sounds. At to be honest, I’m not sure I ever want to know.
The test of time is another brutal test that has rendered many of my alleged ‘favorites’ into boring claptrap. There are, however, those works that do stand the test of time, and we know these are special. The first examples that come to my mind are Beethoven’s ‘Pathetique’ or ‘Moonlight’ sonatas.
I’m not sure I really agree. Aside from Goa, I’m also a total classical fiend. One work of which I am completely obsessed with is Bach’s Die Kunst der Fuge (The Art of Fugue). I have numerous recordings of it (Canadian Brass, Full Orchestral, Emmerson & Juliard String Quartets, Glenn Gould, Berlin Saxophone Quartet, Tatiana Nikolayeva, and a couple others), I have Alfred Mann’s The Study of Fugue book which contains Marpurg’s thesis on fugal technique (which was included in the 2nd printing of the score itself), and also the Czerny & Davitt Moroney scores of the cycle for keyboard. The more I know of the piece, the deeper my insights and awe become of the harmonies and complexities.
The first hearing of any music always produces that state of wonder… but a true masterpiece will also reward you with a state of wonder upon numerous exposures. All of the Shpongle albums fit this category for me. I have had Are You Shpongled since I was handed the CD by someone when Simon played NYNY back in 98 (I think it must have been my Space Tribe clothes with Nepalese embroidery of Om Mani Padme Hum and the Buddha eyes of Swoyambunath which prompted the gift…. which was greatly appreciated) and I still listen to it to this day. I know what’s coming, but the pure craftsmanship and musical ingenuity behind it blow my mind.
Neuro nice to know there are others out there in this community who also dig classical music. I’m a Beethoven man myself but do have a small collection including Bach, Handel, Tchaikovsky, Greig, Chopin and Mozart.
I think that Beethoven has a psy style to his music. 9th Symphony is very much so. As you may know in Corridor of Mirrors there is the track called 9th. Also there are some piano concertos of Beethoven which could be remixed by say Benji or Simon. It would be great I reckon
[quote author=“DiMuTech”]Neuro nice to know there are others out there in this community who also dig classical music. I’m a Beethoven man myself but do have a small collection including Bach, Handel, Tchaikovsky, Greig, Chopin and Mozart.
I think that Beethoven has a psy style to his music. 9th Symphony is very much so. As you may know in Corridor of Mirrors there is the track called 9th. Also there are some piano concertos of Beethoven which could be remixed by say Benji or Simon. It would be great I reckon
Hello Brother!
Beethoven is by far my favourite composer. Die Kunst der Fuge is my favourite single cycle of music… but to look at what old Ludwig produced, his music redefined music itself. The 7th symphony’s 2nd movement (the allegretto), The piano concertos, the vilolin concerto, the other great symphonies, the great sonatas, the works for cello and piano…. why am I even listing, it’s Beethoven. There are very few pieces he wrote which I don’t completely love.
There is something about his style.. emotionally charged true classical with contrapuntal techniques and a depth of harmony that has yet to be surpassed. (some would argue against that point).
In order of love :
Beethoven
Bach
Chopin
everyone else
[quote author=“Neuro”]
There is something about his style.. emotionally charged true classical with contrapuntal techniques and a depth of harmony that has yet to be surpassed. (some would argue against that point).
I agree. So very passionate and with such a fury. Aggressive in parts. And towards the end going deaf and still composing. I don’t know if it’s true but my piano teacher told me that Beethoven cut the legs of a grand piano and composed by feeling the vibration through the floor boards as he was deaf. If true double genius.
I said earlier Piano concertos when I should of said Piano Sonata. Nr 14 Presto Agitato. Basically means really fast. 160bpm. Perhaps Benji can remix this. I tried when I first started to make music but it wasn’t to great :(
[quote author=“DiMuTech”]I said earlier Piano concertos when I should of said Piano Sonata. Nr 14 Presto Agitato. Basically means really fast. 160bpm. Perhaps Benji can remix this. I tried when I first started to make music but it wasn’t to great :(
I love playing that piece, though my forearms feel ripped up afterwards. The rolling arpeggios, that masculine melody… the piece is pure perfection in classical sonata form.
I do prefer Liszt’s nickname for it… moonlight really doesn’t fit well for op27 no2, so Liszt called it “The flower between the Abysses” . Perfect name! The opening abyss of emptiness and the final abyss of dark rage, with that subtle and elegant middle movement.
Very nice to see some fellow Twisted-heads that are into the good classical stuff! I, too, was a concert pianist as a child and have particularly fond memories of Beethoven’s piano sonatas, especially Pathetique and Moonlight, although the 3rd movement of the Moonlight Sonata WILL give you carpal tunnel!
And I see and agree with your point, Neuro, about multiple renditions of the same classical tune. I was more referring to the phenomena of being biased towards music and letting this bias interfere with one’s enjoyment of something unexpected. I will say, however, that I’ve never gotten chills like I did the first time I heard the two above-mentioned Sonatas on a beat-up cassette when I was just a boy, played to perfection by Arthur Rubenstein.
